Thread: Questioning chirine ba kal

I have 6000 troops at my back, I'm not going to dick around with a one on one duel with the enemy general.

In the "Qadarli," the "little wars," which were more like duels, taking the enemy command unit is a good idea.

But the idea that armies ever abided by the result of a "duel of commanders" anytime anywhere is frankly nugatory.

Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya

I have 6000 troops at my back, I'm not going to dick around with a one on one duel with the enemy general.

Monsieur, we have a word here in the France King Louis the Just for a gentleman who feels like that...

Originally Posted by Chgowiz

If you show someone fun at a game, they'll remember it and come back.

That's what you need to do as well... don't get caught up in anyone else's game but your own.

A powerful lesson I learned over the past four years of being involved in cliques and niches of niches is that if I choose to not play "The Game", if I make deliberate choices to avoid the drama, tada, I avoid the drama and I can still get my message across. I did.

That's why I don't get involved in the "OSR" dramas and critiques and what-not. I play my elf-games, I paint and use my funny little figures and I talk about it. If someone gets upset that I don't ascribe to their "ONE TWUE WAY" of things, well... as my more coarse friends would say "fuck 'em".

I'd agree with this. I've seen quite a lot of drama go by in both the industry and the hobby over the years, and it never does any good - it does engender some very deep divisions and bad feelings, and it's had a very negative effect over the decades.

I agree with you; I like to play with my little toy soldiers, and sit around a table telling stories with my friends. Sometimes we'll roll some dice, but mostly we're just into having a good time with friends.

Originally Posted by Greentongue

I remember from reading The Outlaws of the Marsh that it was common for the leaders to have a personal battle.
That the results of this seriously effected moral and could determine the side that won.

From EPT I get the impression that this is also the case.
Has The Glorious General personally beating the opponents commander effectively won the field?

Was this a common method for quickly resolving large battles?

Goes this scale?
Is any confrontation able to be bargained such that the leaders win or loss is accepted by their followers as resolving the conflict?
=

Bear with me; this will be a little involved. There are three 'levels' of conflict, based on intensity and complication.

Starting with the biggest, we have the 'Qadardali", 'The Great War'. This is fought among nation-states, usually against each other, but also against the hostile non-humans and 'uncivilized peoples'. This level is characterized by large armies going on campaign, and usually in large numbers of troops.

Large-scale battles, as were described by the Professor in a couple of articles, usually start with 'champion duels', where individuals step out and fight their opposites for the honor of their legion. These do not 'settle' the outcome of the battle, but they do affect morale - a string of losses can depress an army, and sap it's will to fight. In the various sets of miniatures rules for Tekumel - my own included - these are handled in the game with a series of dice rolls and a consequent adjustment to the morale factors; in my own rules, there is also an option to use one's preferred RPG rules to run the fight, which allows for more participation by PCs in the action.

In the "Qadarni", the 'Little Wars', you do see a lot more champion duels - including some by senior officers - as these are fights for honor and reputation. These have about a single cohort of soldiers on each side, about 400 to 500 each, and are very formalized and ritualistic. See also the Meso-American 'Flower Wars' for more about these. These fights are very suited for RPG play, and as incidents in RPG campaigns.

Finally, we have the 'private' fights, where individuals or clans have a conflict they they just can't resolve any other way. In these cases, which are pretty rare, the opposing sides will adjourn to the local arena, where their champions and possibly small 'teams' will fight it out to settle the issue once and for all. The results are binding on both parties, and this is very strictly enforced by the Imperium. Going 'out in back of the barn' is forbidden in urban areas, but I have heard of one or two incidents where opponents had thinly-disguised 'country parties' out in the sticks where they would not be disturbed while they fought it out; this is considered very 'low-class' and 'common', as anyone with any pretensions of nobility and honor would do their fighting in the arena.

These are really suited to RPGs, I think.

Riots are Right Out, and the Imperium gets really cranky about those and the people who start them.

Does this help?

Years of chasing and being chased through the deserts of Milumanaya tends to blunt one's taste for ritual, doesn't it?

We usually said "I will dress appropriately for the occasion." I hired a valet at 6th level when I became a citizen to help with this.