From GameDaddy:
Now that's interesting. Would have never guessed this based on my unofficial Interview with Dave back in 2004. A couple things. Did know he was a grognard, and that he liked naval miniatures games. Always thought he was very much like me, and liked both wargames, and roleplaying games, with about an equal measure. These days I lean towards running RPGs more than playing, or wargaming, but I'm still open for just running or playing about any good game.
Keep in mind that our fun times were in the 1980s and your interview was in the 2000s; Dave had had twenty years of finding out that his ideas about gaming - and Gary's too, for that matter - were not in step with the hobby or the industry. I talked with him just before he passed away, and he told me the same things he'd told you. Just twenty years of bitter experience between the two data points.
First time I played EPT was in a campaign around 1980 or so, then after that, it was 1987 before I met another guy that was willing to run the game. I never saw EPT as available, or even on display in any of the hobby shops, toy stores, or game stores that I frequented out in Colorado in the late 70's or early 80's. I heard about the game of course, and it always got great reviews and people who actually had played it spoke about having a good time playing it. After 1981 I didn't see anyone at Ghengis Con (That being the big annual wargaming & RPG convention in Denver) running EPT, and it was simply this mystical thing that was just spoken of, and not seen anywhere in my gaming circles.
Very accurate; once TSR dropped it, that was it for publicity. We could never get Dave or Phil to do anything more then occasional convention appearances. No publicity is no publicity; I even have a copy of a letter from Ehara Tadashi to Phil to this effect.
Same thing with Dave Arneson. He was pretty much off my D&D radar after 1979 or so (more on this later), and he didn't get back on my gaming radar until about 2004 or so. I thought for awhile he just quit and was completely out of gaming all together. I took a sabbatical from any type of gaming myself beginning in 1986, and that break would last until 1991 or so, and then followed that up with another break from 1995 to 1999. These breaks were not caused by gaming, but by other real life distractions that expanded to envelope all the other aspects of my life. Now cold winters indoors in Indiana in the late autumn and winter now give me ample time to work on games in my spare time.
Dave was out of gaming for almost five years, and then was very marginalized. It wasn't until the WotC buyout of his and Gary's rights to the IP that this changed; the two of them were brought back into gaming by the owners at the time of Gen Con and WotC.
...Which brings me to my question. Once I did get back into gaming, I went looking for a copy of EPT. The original TSR boxed set was already sadly out reach, being in the hands of collectors that would bid hundreds, if not thousands of dollars for a single complete original copy of the game. I was talking with Lou Zocchi one day about some of my favorite older games, and I mentioned that I had always been looking for a copy of Empire of the Petal Throne, and he went into the back of his booth, and he fished up a copy of EPT: Swords & Glory Vol I. that had been sitting on the lee side of one of his magazine wracks and said I could have it for $20 (Which I snatched up of course), and after some further discussion ended up buying a perfect set of AWI miniatures rules that he also had in stock, that was a first edition, that had been originally published in 1976. If there's something you really, really want in gaming, even if you don't even think it exists, you can ask Lou about it. If he doesn't have a copy of what you are looking for, he knows someone who does and will hook you up,or will find someone who is interested in creating it for you. He also does real magic tricks.
I like Lou, myself. Gifted story-teller, and a guy who goes around picking up old games and then making them available. If he doesn't have it, it doesnt exist. And he plays the musical saw, too, which is something you don't see every day.
When I asked him about the other EPT rules he simply said they were out of print, and that he had sold out the copies M.A.R. that he had licensed under Gamescience to him to make and sell. Now this book I had (the blue book) was originally published in 1983. Now Dave was still selling EPT at that time. Did he just do another license to Lou for some extra income, or is there another interesting story about all that?
Dave was selling Zocchi books. He sold our stuff, we sold his. No new license involved.
Also, if anyone here happens to have an extra copy of Swords & Glory Vol II: Players Handbook, at a reasonable price, I'd be interested in picking it up, just so that I have the full Gamescience published set. Right now I just use D&D to run EPT, and that works perfectly well, but it would be kind of nice to have the complete EPT.
How many do you want? Now that all of my archives are in digital format - we're working up the index and such - I don't need the surplus paper copies.
The unplanned interview with Dave Arneson
This is a fun interview, too!
Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya
.
?
Bookmarks