Thread: Questioning chirine ba kal

Originally Posted by David Johansen

What I love about GURPS is that it's possible to model described combat in game terms. "I splash acid in his eye!" Okay, you're close enough, roll to hit at -10 if you miss by 2 you hit his face instead. "I fast draw my short sword, and swing at his neck." Roll fast draw, roll to hit at -5, +4 for all out attack, target rolls IQ to avoid mental stun, trys to defend, -4 if stunned. Okay the last one was me and I took the guy's head off in a single blow. The GM just sat there stunned for 1d6 rounds. System mastery means understanding the implications of the rules, not just how to recite them by rote.

I have played such games, and I loathe them. To quote Dave Arneson, "too many rules."

Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya

I have played such games, and I loathe them. To quote Dave Arneson, "too many rules."

Ah. Sorry; I misunderstood.

Sure, and I'm well aware of that. As a matter of fact I've long argued for a slimmed down core for GURPS as a way to bring in new players. At it's core GURPS is 3d6 under stat or skill with skills being based on stats. Hit locations are optional though combat is still pretty detailed. But GURPS combat started as a detailed, one on one gladiatorial game, in Man to Man and carries that heritage.I'm more in love with the combat system than character creation which is so choked with options that you need to know the game pretty well even though the basic method is a simple points buy.

There's plenty of complex games that I don't like as well. But I do prefer a detailed blow by blow to abstraction. When I run D&D for the kids at the store I spend more time explaining that the damage roll indicates how an exchange of many blows came out than I do actually running combat.

But my original point was just that such a system can model exciting and interesting results well. This isn't a GURPS thread after all.

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

My alter-ego started off as a student intending to be a scholar-priest - a historian, actually - when the temple looked at his test scores and shunted him over into the military sorcerer track. What pushed him over into a military career was his being sent as a newbie off to help put down the slave revolt in Ferenara; they were pretty short-handed, he had the needed skills for blasting things into oblivion, and he was expendable; no particularly good clan connections, no money to speak of, just one really good sorcerer with a talent for logistics. (More of a case of the right guy being in the wrong place at the wrong time, then anything else.) He got a reputation for getting the job done, on time and under budget, as well as a reputation for absolute loyalty to the Petal Throne and a well-deserved reputation for not minding breaking a few eggs to make an omelette. In short he killed a lot of people whom the Imperium felt needed killing, and didn't make a lot of mistakes in the process.

The back-story is that Phil took one look at my stats (STR 86, INT 98, CON 97, PSY 00, DEX 89, COM 12) and 'suggested' that I should be a magic-user. I replied that we already had plenty of those, and I had a preference for hitting people over the head with blunt objects; Phil turned to the page in EPT with the 'Priest' class/category/career track. So, I became a warrior-priest of the Temple of Vimuhla, and then spent most of my time cleaning up after the rest of the party. They tended to be a little casual about the details on their adventures, so I got to handle the metaphorical dust-pan and broom for the group.

All of this brought my alter-ego to the attention of Lord Huso, the not-so-secret head of the not-so-secret Incandescent Blaze Society, and that led to a career of 'Errand Boy to the Petal Throne' and 'Chief Exterminator Of Those Whom The Imperium Needs to Have Exterminated'. He's nominally a Kasi with the Legion of the Searing Flame, and collects pay for that, as well as being carried on the rolls of the Legion of Mnashu of Thri'il as Kasi; this, despite it being a Karakan legion, and he's a Vimuhla priest. The Imperium commands, and we obey. I also get a temple stipend, as I'm nominally listed as being assigned to the temple at Bey Su, as well as a personal stipend from the Petal Throne for - shall we say, 'services rendered' - in Khirgar when some git tried to assassinate the newly-revealed Prince Mirusiya hi Tlakotani.

Phil is quite right when he says that the military priests don't go on adventures - they are, as he points out, too busy. I'm not in the usual career track; if anything, I am way outside it and in a very different line of work altogether.

Does any of this help?

Thank you.

Shemek.

Originally Posted by David Johansen

Sure, and I'm well aware of that. As a matter of fact I've long argued for a slimmed down core for GURPS as a way to bring in new players. At it's core GURPS is 3d6 under stat or skill with skills being based on stats. Hit locations are optional though combat is still pretty detailed. But GURPS combat started as a detailed, one on one gladiatorial game, in Man to Man and carries that heritage.I'm more in love with the combat system than character creation which is so choked with options that you need to know the game pretty well even though the basic method is a simple points buy.

There's plenty of complex games that I don't like as well. But I do prefer a detailed blow by blow to abstraction. When I run D&D for the kids at the store I spend more time explaining that the damage roll indicates how an exchange of many blows came out than I do actually running combat.

But my original point was just that such a system can model exciting and interesting results well. This isn't a GURPS thread after all.

As I have been telling my group of players for years: "This is the beauty of Tekumel. You can use any rule system, or no rules at all and still adventure in it." My group has been using a combination of EPT, and AD&D for years and it works fine, although I feel that we could be even more streamlined and reduce everything to a simple percentile roll with appropriate modifiers. Old habits die hard I guess.
I knew someone who set up a Tekumel campaign using Rolemaster, and it worked fine for him and his group. It all comes down to what "floats your boat". I'm more in the "Gronan camp", I prefer less rules, but I do not think that a more rules intensive game is a bad thing. So long as consistency is maintained it's all good.

Shemek.

Chirine,
I was recently looking at the Tekumel map, and I noticed that there are cities/towns indicated on the islands of Hlyssa and Ssru Gatl. It is my understanding that these lands are ruled by the Hlyss, but were they once controlled by man? Are these towns/cities abandoned human ruins or do the Hlyss live there?
The word Hlyss. Is this the Tsolyani name for these creatures? Do you know what the Livyani, or Salarvyani call them?

Shemek.

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

Ah. Sorry; I misunderstood.

...I think the conversational thread has gotten scrambled, I thought I was replying to someone else, old bean. I was referring to highly detailed moment-by-moment rules sets like GURPS.

Once upon a time, I must admit, I was striving for such a thing, but nowadays OD&D with its one minute combat round and "after a full minute of swording* away furiously have you done anything useful to the other bugger" die roll model appeals to me.


*in the word "swording", the "w" is not silent

Originally Posted by David Johansen

Sure, and I'm well aware of that. As a matter of fact I've long argued for a slimmed down core for GURPS as a way to bring in new players. At it's core GURPS is 3d6 under stat or skill with skills being based on stats. Hit locations are optional though combat is still pretty detailed. But GURPS combat started as a detailed, one on one gladiatorial game, in Man to Man and carries that heritage.I'm more in love with the combat system than character creation which is so choked with options that you need to know the game pretty well even though the basic method is a simple points buy.

There's plenty of complex games that I don't like as well. But I do prefer a detailed blow by blow to abstraction. When I run D&D for the kids at the store I spend more time explaining that the damage roll indicates how an exchange of many blows came out than I do actually running combat.

But my original point was just that such a system can model exciting and interesting results well. This isn't a GURPS thread after all.

Oh, okay, thanks for the clarification.

Actually, I must admit that a very detailed combat system is a lot of fun for one-on-one gaming; I played Fantasy Trip that way for several years.

GURPS is a bit like The Fantasy Trip after years and years of a rich diet.

Even so, the core combat system is:
Move= (Dexterity + Health)/4 - Encumbrance
Initiative in order of Move ties broken by the unmodified and unrounded Move

To Hit Roll = 3d6 equal to or less than appropriate weapon skill (or Dexterity for unskilled punches)
Target may either:
Parry = Weapon Skill / 2 + 3 Shield Bonus (+1 if they retreat a hex)
Block = Shield Skill / 2 + 3 + Shield Bonus (+1 if they retreat a hex)
Dodge = Move - Encumbrance + 3

All out Attack Option (up to half move, no defense roll, either +4 to hit, +2 damage, or 2 attacks)
All out Defense move (make no attack but, make two defenses against each attack but no more than one of each type)
Dodge = Movement Rate +3 + Shield Bonus (+3 if they retreat a hex)

Damage = Swing or Thrust damage as appropriate to weapon (a 10 ST fighter with a broad sword does 1d6+1 Cutting or 1d6 Impaling)
Armor is subtracted from Damage total (some weapons have an armor divisor to represent penetration, light sabres divide armor by 10)
Remaining Damage is multiplied by 1.5 for cutting weapons and 2 for impaling weapons)

Shock and pain cause a -1 to hit for every 2 points of damage on the target's next turn.
Damage from a single blow greater than half Hit Points (which equal Strength, in 4e) stun the target, -4 to defenses, roll Health to recover on next turn or take no action.
Total Damage greater than Hit Points requires a Health roll to remain conscious each turn.
Total Damage greater than twice Hit Points requires a Health roll to remain alive each turn.

That's not so bad right? The devil's in the details of course. Hit locations and armor by locations get more complex as do advanced options like martial arts maneuvers and of course grappling There's an entire technical grappling source book for those who want it. This is GURPS we're talking about after all!

Oh wait! No it's not! I can move or delete the summary if you like.

Chirine,

Out of curiosity, would you happen to know what the ancient N'luss/Dragon Warriors name for Vimuhla is?

Shemek