But it would seem that Ramsay learnt them well.Originally Posted by Hermes Serpent
Shemek
But it would seem that Ramsay learnt them well.
Shemek
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
Mark Twain
Hurry back Mighty Hrugga. There's no end of demon's to swat.
Shemek
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
Mark Twain
So, some things come to mind, and in no particular order.
1. where was his counter-fire?
2. what was his armour orbat. How many and what mark of Panzer IV's, STUG's, Panthers, Tigers?
3. how many 88's did he have?
4. his force was primarily what? Inf, Arm, PzGrnd, Fallsch ?
5. did he stay fixed, or did he redeploy?
6. was this a one off scenario, or was it linked to a campaign?
7. if it was a campaign, why not do what Jerry always did: fall back and redeploy?
8. what distances are we talking about vis-a-vis FEBA - FLET?
9. the wildcats were in defilade, but were the shermans as well?
10. at what odds were you at?
I would have loved to have seen this one play out. I have played similar scenarios in Panzer Leader. They are tough to do right for either side. Hoping someone will fall into your trap is a risky thing. You've got to be on your toes. In the words of Old Blood and Guts: “There is no such thing as luck, merely opportunity meeting preparedness." George S. Patton Jr.
After reading this account I got a sudden hankering for some WW2 wargaming. Well it's a long weekend coming up... I might have to dig out Panzer Leader and Panzer Blitz., and find an opponent.
Shemek
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
Mark Twain
Don't have time for a full reply. The Germans had a pretty sizeable force; I expected it to be a challenge for the US to get through with the full 2/3 force. Frankly when he opened up with his sole emplaced 88 on a jeep from 3 KM away I knew it was going to be a bad day for the Wehrmacht. If he'd opened up with one of his nearby MG34s on the jeep the US would have known nothing other than that the jeep stopped reporting back.
The battlefield had a total depth of over 3 KM. One of the nice things about Coffman Memorial Student Union at the University of Minnesota... they had LOTS of tables. Probably about 3.5 x 1.5-2 KM.
I don't care if you respect me, just buy my fucking book.
Formerly known as Old Geezer
I don't need an Ignore List, I need a Tongue My Pee Hole list.
The rules can't cure stupid, and the rules can't cure asshole.
That's the first thing I thought of. I would never have used an 88 on a jeep. I agree, this was the beginning of the end for him. Can't wait for the full break down of events from you and Chirine.
Shemek
Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
Mark Twain
Tom was young and very green at the time. However, he wasn't stupid, and read and studied and practiced over the years. Unfortunately, he never quite figured out what to do about the fact that Chrine had ALSO read all those books on WW2...
I don't care if you respect me, just buy my fucking book.
Formerly known as Old Geezer
I don't need an Ignore List, I need a Tongue My Pee Hole list.
The rules can't cure stupid, and the rules can't cure asshole.
From Shemek hiTankolel:
So, some things come to mind, and in no particular order.
1. where was his counter-fire?
I dunno. Every now and then a Sherman would get hit, so I knew he was out there.
2. what was his armour orbat. How many and what mark of Panzer IV's, STUG's, Panthers, Tigers?
As I recall, a platoon or two of King Tigers, a company of Panthers, a company of infantry in half-tracks, a recon platoon of Pumas, and some Luftwaffe guys with an 88mm flak gun. We had the lovely model, and it seemed a shame not to use it.
3. how many 88's did he have?
One towed, six mobile in the King Tigers.
4. his force was primarily what? Inf, Arm, PzGrnd, Fallsch ?
I'd guess Panzer Grenadiers, form the half-tracks.
5. did he stay fixed, or did he redeploy?
He stayed fixed in place, as I recall.
6. was this a one off scenario, or was it linked to a campaign?
It was a one off, but with campaign-style victory conditions. I had to get through, and he had to stop me or kill most of my forces.
7. if it was a campaign, why not do what Jerry always did: fall back and redeploy?
I would have done this anyway when things went rotten, but then I always play as if it's a campaign battle.
8. what distances are we talking about vis-a-vis FEBA - FLET?
No real idea; see Gronan's reply. The table was something like five by nine feet, as I recall; plenty of room.
9. the wildcats were in defilade, but were the shermans as well?
Nope. The Shermans were all out in plain sight in open terrain. I did pop a lot of smoke, though, and just kept shooting.
10. at what odds were you at?
Maybe three to one in numbers, but even odds qualitatively. It was set up as a very tough fight for the Americans.
I would have loved to have seen this one play out. I have played similar scenarios in Panzer Leader. They are tough to do right for either side. Hoping someone will fall into your trap is a risky thing. You've got to be on your toes. In the words of Old Blood and Guts: “There is no such thing as luck, merely opportunity meeting preparedness." George S. Patton Jr.
After reading this account I got a sudden hankering for some WW2 wargaming. Well it's a long weekend coming up... I might have to dig out Panzer Leader and Panzer Blitz., and find an opponent.
It was a lot of fun to play, as going into it I knew it was going to be very, very tough. I had to think very fast and on my feet, and be decisive. And it all worked out, I thought...
Last edited by chirine ba kal; 06-30-2016 at 02:05 AM. Reason: typo
Which is why I sent out a jeep with with a radio.
Tom was one of those gamers who, when they had a big powerful weapon to hand, just had to use it.
Bounding overwatch. Traveling overwatch. Works just as well in an RPG as it does in a 'wargame'. (I don't see a difference between the two, but what do I know?) We used to do this in Underworlds and other nasty situations, and Phil found it very hard to surprise us.
Next case study: The Door
Tom had a habit of buying and reading stuff that was more in the genre of campaign histories; he was very well-versed in the big picture and grand strategies, but he tended to neglect the 'less popular' in style and the more tactical. He was of the school of gaming that later saw the rise of the 'gimmick' army or the 'points value' army, where one simply bought - either in the campaign or in real life - stuff that was really powerful if you were going by the stats or numbers. He tended to rely on the numbers and gimmicks instead of the basics of tactics and terrain, and it cost him I don't know how many battles as a result.
Looking back on it over the intervening years, Tom wasn't all that much fun to play against. His massive armies usually seemed to fall right apart at the seams when he ran up against somebody (like Gronan or I) who knew something of the period or setting being played. In my experience, battles with him as the opposing side would usually be tipped one way or the other on the first or second turn, when he would 'push the button' to activate whatever special unit or weapon he had.
Fred, bless him, was always a fearsome opponent no matter what the period or setting. He never, ever made the same mistake twice; he was a very fast and astute learner, very well read, and very very serious about doing the best job that he could. In my experience, you could beat Fred once in any game or setting, normally his first game in that set of rules or world-setting. After that first game, you were always sure of a very tough and close game with him on the other side of the table.
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