Thread: Questioning chirine ba kal - part II

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

I looked that reference up, having only seen a copy of the game on the shelf in the FLGS, but I'd say that you are right. I do wish other people would read it, as they might realize just what I really am.

I knew it!

Yes; I always think in strategic terms, as all too many opponents in all sorts of games have learned. I think in long-term goals and objectives, not in short-term tactical ones. And it's always been a great help to me that quite a few of my opponents over the decades have been so predictable, and can be counted on to not to think but to 'shot from the hip'. It makes them so much easier to manipulate, especially as so many of them don't stop and think what my goals and objectives might be, or what might be their - and my - optimal outcomes.

I can only nod and grin, Uncle!

I will freely admit that this does annoy some people, when I decline combat at that point in time; I can remember one huge "Chainmail" game that Gronan ran where I opened the battle by retreating, at which my opponents called me a coward and other, nastier, things. They pressed their attack, and then discovered that I had conducted a fighting withdrawal into a superb defensive position, and being gamers quite willingly stuffed their larger army into my troops' meat grinder. They had 10-1 odds on me, and lost 10 to 1 casualties. I laughed a lot over that one...

Was there terrain that you used, Uncle? Or did you just retreat firing to void their first attacks and then presented them with a refused center allowing you to concentrate your attacks on them?

I happen to prefer offensive defensive battles, if I can use that phrase, as it never seem to occur to people - aside from Gronan, who knows better! - that I might find it very much to my advantage to allow myself to be attacked...

Of course you may find it so. Don't these people at least watch boxing, fer anything's sake?

Agincourt. Crecy. Poitiers. Waterloo. Gettysburg. Sedan. Omdurman. To name a few. I am that most dangerous of all foes, a historian with a good memory - the the wit to use it...

I think Hastings also should be there.

Originally Posted by Zirunel

I didn't realize that, very interesting. Specializing that rapidly into linguistics would explain why his broader background in anthropology and archaeology seems more, what....limited...or dated...than you'd expect........ I always assumed he went through the full academic cursus, but I guess not.

So in a sense, Tekumel didn't "evolve" so much as it exploded in two separate growth spurts 20 years apart?

Agreed; while he made and kept a lot of friends in Meso-American and Egyptian studies, his academic 'time in grade' was very much of a certain time in those fields. He wasn't at all academically active in them, as near as I can tell, after he went over to serious language work. I did't find out about his academic career in much detail until I was going through the files; he just never mentioned it in conversations.

Yes, I very much think so; he seemed to work best and be most creative when surrounded by a good audience. He had that at in the early 1950s - the other players in the 'proto-campaign' went on to very distinguished academic careers in languages themselves - and again in the late '70s into the middle '80s. He seemed to need a certain interactive dynamic, that flourished in specific times and places, with a certain collection of individuals.

I do think his Tekumel evolved in some ways, but it was a matter of detail rather then broad conception. I could run a very recognizable RPG campaign with just the 1950s material, and I strongly doubt anyone except a trivia buff would ever know the difference.

Originally Posted by Baron

I've got a question. Someone recently posted an old adventure written for EPT called Mysteries of the Crimson Chamber. In it, the author describes technology of the ancients and will often say that if the device in question were to be dismantled, something like an Eye of (fill in the blank) could be recovered. I wondered if this is something that happened in your games with the Professor, or could be reasonably extrapolated from events you witnessed. What is the true nature of Eyes? I believe they are mentioned as unusual equipment available in the Humanspace Empires playtest document, as well... Thanks! (Oh, and apologies if this has already been discussed, I'm still hundreds of pages behind in my reading!)

Yep; have it in the files. We didn't see this in Phil's games, because we learned very early on not to try to dismantle devices of the Ancients; it never seemed to go well, and people got tired of being blown up. On the other hand, a number of the Undying Wizards have been known to do this, and things still work right afterwards. It should be remembered that Phil was simply not into technology; he didn't have a really good idea of how things like light switches worked - all he cared about was that if he flipped the switch, the light came on. If it didn't, you called in a wizard or sorcerer to deal with the problem.

The text in the adventure is, I think, a very reasonable extrapolation of how the technology of the Ancients might work; it makes sense from an engineering standpoint, and it's also a useful plot device for use in games. Eyes are, Phil once said, the Humanspace version of cordless power tools; they do useful things, but only if one is willing to make the investment in the technology in order to have a forklift or something in your belt pouch. (Phil was speaking in the early 1980s, when these kinds of tools were rare and expensive, by the way.) So, taking something apart and finding a module that did X makes sense, and is certain to get players in deep trouble - which was also one of Phil's delights; see also the number of times we had to stitch Origo back together.

How they work is sort of known in general outline; they draw power and create effects. That's as far as Phil went, because it was all he needed to keep things moving along.

(We had talked about this a bit, but not in any real detail. Do ask, please!!!)

Originally Posted by Greentongue

I do remember that in Flamesong there was at least one being worked on in the underwater lab.
(If I recall correctly. Been a few years since I read it.)
=

Yep; full of 'filaments', as I recall.

Originally Posted by Hrugga

That would be interesting(maybe for one from the temple of Ksarul,etc)...but the parts would be hard to come by or manufacture(in my Tekumel).

I think the "eye" works kind of like a lens. It pulls extra-planar energy and depending on its circuitry/parts determines the result.

Uncle I am sure will shed light on the subject.

H:0)

Parts? Oh, that's a reason to have adventures all by themselves. Mayhem will result!

From AsenRG:
I knew it!
Don't give away all my secrets, please...

I can only nod and grin, Uncle!
Yep. I think ahead, and most people don't.

Was there terrain that you used, Uncle? Or did you just retreat firing to void their first attacks and then presented them with a refused center allowing you to concentrate your attacks on them?
I pulled my pike blocks back into a position where they had absolute security for their flanks from terrain features that my opponents hadn't scouted out, and made sure to keep peppering them with arrows from my skirmishers to keep them busy; the vast majority of gamers have absolutely no clue what to do with light infantry, so I had a great time as the lights screened the rest of my army as they formed up with the crossbowmen in checker-board formations - the precursor to the classic tercio formation, actually. I had a grand time grinding them down in a battle of attrition; they broke first, and I turned loose my cavalry to keep them running.

Of course you may find it so. Don't these people at least watch boxing, fer anything's sake?
As near as I can tell, no.

I think Hastings also should be there.
Understood, and I see why. I would not have offered battle, meaning no disrespect to Harold, as I'd be looking at the state of my little army of professionals after Stamford Bridge. Yes, the English won that one, but at the cost of enough casualties to make the next battle more risky. I would have preferred to pause and refit, but I don't think that Harold had that option - fascinating campaign, and a great game for three sets of players to represent the three main factions. If you add in the northern Earls, then it becomes a five-handed game, and we're well into Braunstein territory. You could also throw in the Welsh, just to make everyone miserable, and/or the various continental factions who had no love for any of the people involved.

Originally Posted by Hrugga

Ahhh...Mayhem ensues!!! Music to my ears!!! Adventures abound!!!

H:0)

Undying Wizard pops in, asks party to nip down to ancient spaceport to pick up packet of parts for Eye in return for 'a favor'. Mayhem ensues. We did this a few times...