Thread: Questioning chirine ba kal - part II

Originally Posted by Zirunel

So I remember back in the 70s when D&D became a thing, and the historical minis manufacturers suddenly "discovered" fantasy. There were some figure sets that came out that, quite frankly, even as a tween, I found to be prurient and rather embarrassing. The bondage and torture chamber themes in particular made their appearance in a big way and to me seemed juvenile and, well, icky. So in theory I can imagine passing judgement on minis, because I did it myself once. But mere nudity/semi-nudity? I can't quite put myself in a place where that would be a big deal. I guess a visit to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the British Museum, the Prado, Louvre, what have you, would be out of the question for these people.

I'm not from the U.S. myself, but I have a feeling some of those attitudes actually are American, and much less prevalent in Europe, or even in the rest of the Anglo world. Could be wrong about that, but the religious fundamentalist contingent seems to hold a sway there that they don't in most other western countries

Agreed. I saw them too, and even back then thought that some of Citadel's offerings were just a little too over the top.

Agreed on your second point, too; I've only seen it here on this side of the pond, and not the other.

Originally Posted by Zirunel

So I remember back in the 70s when D&D became a thing, and the historical minis manufacturers suddenly "discovered" fantasy. There were some figure sets that came out that, quite frankly, even as a tween, I found to be prurient and rather embarrassing. The bondage and torture chamber themes in particular made their appearance in a big way and to me seemed juvenile and, well, icky. So in theory I can imagine passing judgement on minis, because I did it myself once. But mere nudity/semi-nudity? I can't quite put myself in a place where that would be a big deal. I guess a visit to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the British Museum, the Prado, Louvre, what have you, would be out of the question for these people.

I'm not from the U.S. myself, but I have a feeling some of those attitudes actually are American, and much less prevalent in Europe, or even in the rest of the Anglo world. Could be wrong about that, but the religious fundamentalist contingent seems to hold a sway there that they don't in most other western countries

Agreed. I saw them too, and even back then thought that some of Citadel's offerings were just a little too over the top.

Agreed on your second point, too; I've only seen it here on this side of the pond, and not the other.

Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya

The US was founded largely by Puritans who left England because they weren't allowed to be assholes to people who went to church and said different words from them.

That influence still runs deep.

Very much so, and it crops in the the ( to me ) oddest ways.

Originally Posted by David Johansen

I've occasionally wondered if the censorship brigade jumped to feminism because the Born Again Christians were too rational and tame for them. Even so, I'm convinced that it's really the same people it's always been and they're just flying a new flag for maximum coverage. Sadly, if you believe these things are cyclical, we're due for a swing in that direction.

Interestingly, my evangelical pastor brother-in-law says that he sees the same sort of thing from both sides of the political spectrum, and he and his congregation are pretty tired of being told what they should think and believe by all these other people. I'm reminded of Rufus T. Firefly, and his song in "Duck Soup" about being against everything...

Alternative Armies still has a very similar torture chamber set in production. I think that side of things will always be there. There will always be a market for it.

Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya

The US was founded largely by Puritans who left England because they weren't allowed to be assholes to people who went to church and said different words from them.

That influence still runs deep.

Got to admit, Glorious General, that's an interesting outlook on history that I've heard before, but discarded at the time.
I'll have to reconsider it.

Originally Posted by David Johansen

I've occasionally wondered if the censorship brigade jumped to feminism because the Born Again Christians were too rational and tame for them. Even so, I'm convinced that it's really the same people it's always been and they're just flying a new flag for maximum coverage. Sadly, if you believe these things are cyclical, we're due for a swing in that direction.

That would explain a lot, wouldn't it?

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

I'll have a look! Thanks!

Sure, Uncle, but "you receive XP after you squander everything you gained last session" might be just a tad bit counterpoductive for Tekumel.

Originally Posted by David Johansen

Alternative Armies still has a very similar torture chamber set in production. I think that side of things will always be there. There will always be a market for it.

And now I wonder whether I want to google that!
Probably not.

Yeah, I opted not to link to it.

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

The Amarna wall paintings are offensive, ERB is offensive, Frank Frazetta is offensive, and the list goes on and on and on. It baffles me, it really does, but then I've been told that I'm "not socially aware" and "out of touch with the political realities of the hobby".

It would seem to take a pretty low threshold of offense to make the Amarna style offensive. Compare that to precolumbian Moche ceramics from the north coast of Peru, some of which, in the Museo Larco in Lima, are in a separate "adults-only" gallery, or even some of the Attic redware from Greece which can be....well, "frank."

But speaking of Frank, is Frazetta really considered offensive nowadays?

Originally Posted by chirine ba kal

Official fair warning notice! An Eeeeevil Plot looms!

Over on the AoI Q&A thread, I've had the notion that it might be funny to ship Gronan in for the Free RPG Day. The cost is not all that bed - cheaper then my going to a convention - and the resulting laughs would be right up there with some of our best moments in gaming. People say the the two of us riffing off each other is truly something to see, and it might be fun to salt the table with a few ringers. We shall see...

Fortunately, I will be in town!

And I'm more touched by the offer of funding than I can say.

Remember the time we foiled Victor's invasion of some planet with nothing more than a telephone system?