Thread: Questioning chirine ba kal - part II

Originally Posted by Zirunel

I have a question for Chirine and Gronan about the importance of clans in "game" Tekumel.

If you look a the published games, there is a lot of evolution, clans get only passing reference in 1975, then by 1983 they are an important part of the setting, then by the 1990s clan has become paramount, almost the name of the game, to where Tekumel is basically an RPG about living in clans.

But I am curious about the 70s, and the early role of clans at the Professor's table. Were they always the big deal that would emerge later in, say, The Sourcebook? Or did that evolve over time?

Clans were very important almost from day 1. By 1976, for certain. It was especially bad for those of us who started as southern barbarians once Mirusiya's "New Men," who were all native citizens, came along. Korunme, who at the time was Kasi Hlych'ptu, was openly mocked and scorned in front of his superior officers by other PCs for being clanless. What made it far worse is that I was insulted personally out of game as well.

Originally Posted by Dumarest

Thanks.

Straight from the horse's mouth(that do exist on Tekumel somewhere)!!!

Enjoy,

H:0)

Originally Posted by Greentongue

Reading Man of Gold isn't a bad way to get a feel of the setting.
=

Cool, I did not know the creator wrote novels set there. I once saw a copy of the game, a boxed set if I remember right, on the lower shelf at a shop that dealt in comic books and roleplaying games back in the very early 1980s, but I had no idea what "Empire of the Petal Throne" was and I think I assumed it was a D&D setting or something. Needless to say, I didn't get it as I have never been much of a D&D player anyway, but now I see 600+ pages related to it on this forum so naturally I'm curious what all the hubbub is about.

Originally Posted by Zirunel

I have a question for Chirine and Gronan about the importance of clans in "game" Tekumel.

If you look a the published games, there is a lot of evolution, clans get only passing reference in 1975, then by 1983 they are an important part of the setting, then by the 1990s clan has become paramount, almost the name of the game, to where Tekumel is basically an RPG about living in clans.

But I am curious about the 70s, and the early role of clans at the Professor's table. Were they always the big deal that would emerge later in, say, The Sourcebook? Or did that evolve over time?

Well, they were pretty important when I started in early '76, and we wound up doing a lot of publishing on the subject over the years. Being part of a clan was a cornerstone of Phil's interpretation of his world-setting; however, it didn't get much air time originally as TSR felt that gamers would have difficulty understanding the concept. Once Phil began to self-publish through us, this began to change.

Originally Posted by Dumarest

Out of curiosity, what's a good starting place to read about Tekumel/EPT (is that interchangeable)? This thread is so full of obscure references, it makes it difficult to gauge or engage with the setting being discussed.

Written text? EPT, followed by Phil's available novels. On line? The tekumel.com website, as Hrugga says.

Originally Posted by Gronan of Simmerya

Clans were very important almost from day 1. By 1976, for certain. It was especially bad for those of us who started as southern barbarians once Mirusiya's "New Men," who were all native citizens, came along. Korunme, who at the time was Kasi Hlych'ptu, was openly mocked and scorned in front of his superior officers by other PCs for being clanless. What made it far worse is that I was insulted personally out of game as well.

Agreed. We saw that as well, which is why we spilt the groups. See also Fine's "Shared Fantasy".

Still won't go anywhere near them, even after all these years.

Originally Posted by Dumarest

Cool, I did not know the creator wrote novels set there. I once saw a copy of the game, a boxed set if I remember right, on the lower shelf at a shop that dealt in comic books and roleplaying games back in the very early 1980s, but I had no idea what "Empire of the Petal Throne" was and I think I assumed it was a D&D setting or something. Needless to say, I didn't get it as I have never been much of a D&D player anyway, but now I see 600+ pages related to it on this forum so naturally I'm curious what all the hubbub is about.

There's a huge body of work that was done in and about the world-setting, over the years. I am supposedly the 'greatest living authority' on the setting, and people seem to like asking me questions.

And the writing still goes on; I'm 127,000 words into an account of our adventures over the decade plus we had with Phil. If I may offer a small sample, from the Preface to Book One of "To Serve The Petal Throne":

Since before the beginnings of recorded time, humankind had looked up into the night sky at the myriad points of light and wondered. Eventually, in the fullness of that time, the first steps were taken out into that starry night. Humankind went, in a single bound, from being alone on their homeworld to being part of a galaxy-spanning community of beings of diverse shapes and sizes. Some were friendly, some were hostile, and some plainly disinterested in the doings of humans and neutral to them.

Humankind spread across the stars, and established their own empire; the Lords of Humanspace assimilated many technologies and sciences, and eventually became masters of matter and energy. This mastery brought them in to alliances and conflicts, and in one particular case brought them a contract with another of the galaxy�s races; they wanted to have an entire planet adapted for their use, and this the Lords of Humanspace could do.

One of five worlds orbiting a bright, hot star, the chosen planet was at the juncture of several important trade routes between the more densely-populated areas of space; the world was wanted as a trading center and a place where the rulers of the galaxy could rest from their labors.

It was of little matter that the world was already inhabited; the Lords of Humanspace did not consider such minor things as being worthy of their notice. Mighty weapons were deployed, even mightier engines of change and transformation were brought into play, and the new world became a place where humankind and their allies could call home. The inhabitants were allowed to survive; to survive, and nurse their hatred of the alien beings who had transformed their planet and confined them to the more remote regions of it.

The Lords of Humanspace, and their allies, for all their power and mastery were not the most highly endowed races in the universe. Others, older and more alien yet, held that position, and they too had their rivalries and conflicts. To these older races, the all-powerful Lords of Humanspace were as toys to a child.

There came a time when these older races had a mighty conflict, and employed powers unimaginable to Humankind. The newly-transformed world was cast out of space and time, and the trapped peoples of the new world looked up into a sky without stars.

The high civilization that the Lords of Humanspace had brought to the new world collapsed - here, suddenly; there, slowly. Humankind is, however, nothing if not adaptable and resilient; civilization began a long, slow climb back into the light and out of the utter darkness that had befallen it. New technologies of the mind, which became known as �sorcery�, replaced the lost technology of the Ancients � as the Lords of Humanspace had become known � and empires and kingdoms rose and fell as the centuries passed into dust.

Humans and their alien allies built and strove, and created new civilizations out of the ashes of the old. Heroes and villians abounded, and new legends were born out of the tales of their battles and quests. In every generation, new heroes and heroines were born, and their legends added to the mythology and history of their world. Gods and goddesses, some based on the memories of the old races that has cast the world into darkness and some created by the mnds of their worshippers, abounded and made their presence in the world known to their worshippers and their competitors.

Some traces of the old technology survived, and became highly sought-after and coveted treasures. Some of what was left of the old world was beneficial and useful; other devices could kill at a touch. All of the inhabitants of the world understood this, and the quest for these wonders was left to a new breed of �adventurers�, who took the most horrific risks in order to obtain the most generous of rewards.

And so it begins; tales of wonder, and of people not yet born, and of lands not yet known�
Come with us; our journey is just begun�